The 2024 Ford Maverick has a single fuse for the telematics unit that you can remove without throwing a code or an error. No idea if this remained true after the 2025-2026 refresh, but worth knowing.
https://www.mavericktruckclub.com/forum/threads/telematics-f...
Kias have a “Massachusetts mode” flag hidden behind a service menu (that needs a dealer code) that disables telematics at the owner’s request. However, the service menu pin also has timeout protection that will inject a waiting period between retries so there is no guessing.
I don’t think there’s convincing my dealer to get into the service menu and disabling it.
I would presume that other manufacturers might have this as well.
I was able to enter dealer mode on my 2023 Kia using this tutorial. https://youtu.be/Q2AEhGYnOaA
It let me disable telematics, and Kia support confirmed that my car was flagged as a "Massachusetts variant" even though it wasn't purchased in MA.
Give one of the mechanics $500 and I bet they’ll accidentally drop the password on the floor of the car as they get out after moving it inside to change the oil.
Or someone get access to 5.5 cyber or mythos and brute force their way in
I bet if you can speak to the mechanic without the service advisor supervising the innteraction $100 would do it.
Yea but it’s worth at least $500 to me so I’d give the guy more, personally. $100 is a nice dinner out, $500 might help pay a bill.
can i have a five hundred?
> I don't think there's convincing my dealer...
How far do you live from Massachusetts, and how do your feel about driving vacations?
> I would presume that other manufacturers might have this as well.
On newer vdubs there’s both a “location services” and a “offline mode” toggle in the infotainment, though this only turns the infotainment SIM off. Obviously this also disables remotely controlling the car using the app.
And the secondary eCall SIM cannot be disabled - not without triggering a fault code and a tell-tale. Since eCall is considered a safety-critical system it has self-monitoring and must work for the vehicle to pass inspection. It even has its own separate power supply. This is true for any vehicle (type) newer than ~2018 in the EU. This probably makes tracking the rough location of any eCall-equipped vehicle quite easy, if you have signaling-level access to the cell network – exactly like in all those SS7 exploits.
edit: turns out they thought about that and eCall modules aren’t supposed to constantly stay connected to a cellular network (dormant mode). Instead they only log onto the cellular network when needed. Difficult to verify as a consumer though.
> Kias have a “Massachusetts mode” flag hidden behind a service menu (that needs a dealer code) that disables telematics at the owner’s request.
I would be very concerned that the flag just continues to submit your data but with a "telematics disabled" bit set on it. This is absolutely how location privacy is implemented in some devices. Moreover, even if it is effective it could be remotely reset including accidentally as part of an update.
Better than not setting it, I suppose! :)
I'm more afraid of the likelihood of someone smashing the window on a modern Kia thinking they can start it up with an iPhone lightning cable (just look up "Kia Boys" if you're confused by any of this) and drive off with it, when in fact, they cannot anymore. Unfortunately, until people stop breaking into Kias I'll avoid the brand in perpetuity.
Nah, not an issue in Canada since immobilizers are mandatory.
Not an issue with modern Kias in the US since they come with them but previous models did not, so guess what people will break into it regardless. Criminal will break the window, try and then leave your car damaged.
OK, except the kids these days have the cheap Autel immo/key programmers and the Autel universal keys. They're just cracking into cars, plugging in the Autel, and running the all-keys-lost procedure on quite a few makes and models and just driving away.
You can get an Autel KM100 for under ~$400 from China. Worked great to program in a couple spare keys for my car and less than what the dealer was gonna charge...
https://www.10tv.com/article/news/local/teens-indicted-colum...
Older Toyotas also had a DCM fuse, and this was the easiest way to get rid of telemetry. I am not sure if partially disassembling the dash and physically removing the DCM is now necessary.
There's still a fuse for the DCM even in this car but:
- It has an internal battery and will keep running for quite a while after pulling the fuse. This is a safety feature in case you get in a crash that disconnects the 12V battery
- It will break your in-car microphone as discussed. Repairing that requires opening up the dash
- That won't do anything for disconnecting the GPS antenna
GPS is receive only. If you've disabled the ability to send telemetry, there should be no reason to be concerned about the GPS antenna.
If it keeps collecting telemetry it could upload it later if it ever gets the chance. Better it isn't collected in the first place.
Good point, but in practice I think the only way onboard data could be exfiltrated is by a dealer while the car is being serviced. If you DIY or hire an independent mechanic, this seems unlikely.
Or by the FBI, NSA, CIA, DHS, or some other interested entity.
If a TLA is interested in you then you don't need to worry about a data log in your car.
I find comfort in thinking that, if a TLA is interested in me, they have to work a little bit harder.
They don't. They have all internet traffic dragnetted and satellite imaging and radar far beyond what is publicly disclosed. They don't need to check in with some low res crap that insurance companies use to nickel and dime you. If you're trying to escape surveillance and control from TLAs then you better start your moon base plans soon.
The kind of organized crime that those people should be focused on are also resistant to this kind of tracking. The cartels and gangs just use burner cars that they dump, possibly with the keys and title still in it. Good luck doing much with the log but you've got the log and even the entire car to try and gather all the evidence you want. This tracking is mainly for hemming up small fry and productive citizens.
That also means it isn't passed to your phone via android auto / carplay. Phone GPS is much worse than car GPS for road navigation. It's basically unusable.
I've successfully used it in my 2006 Ford Fiesta for about 10 years now...
The reliability is way better than GitHub's uptime.
Better even than my car's uptime.
You must work in telco.
99.9999% or it's unusable :P
My SO immediately sniffed out when the GPS antenna was unplugged from a car with carplay. Unacceptably low spouse approval factor.
My Ford ~(2018 era SYNC system) has GPS and Bluetooth but no cellular modem.
It still technically is used for telemetry... but only when you get into a wreck. It'll ping the onboard GPS at that time for coordinates, then place a voice call over your paired cellphone to 911 with TTS coordinates and information about the wreck.
"Attention. A side crash with rollover has occured in a Ford vehicle. Multiple impacts detected. The maximum speed change was 38 miles per hour. Airbags deployed. Detected ONE seatbelt fastened. Press 1 at any time for location information, or press 0 at any time to speak with vehicle occupants."
This is addressed in the blog :)