The EFF or some other watchdog should put out some public ads that depict corporations as a creepy person stalking someone:
It's a lot more disgusting and universally hated when you hear about a peeping tom, or a pervert, or a jealous ex hounding someone,
but when faceless corporations and governments do it to EVERYBODY 24/7, everyone's like, ehh.
I mean, right now, just think about me, clicking on your HN profile, googling your name, going through all your public photos.. Don't you find me repulsive just talking about that?
This puts me in mind of the infamous GMail Man commercial that Microsoft put out:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=oR4jTvxPruw
It's about intention. I don't want someone threatening or evil going through my info but don't mind stuff being public in general, like this comment for example.
Yes, but when the surveillance is sweeping, global and total, you can’t really be sure about “intent”, current or future.
i get a little thrill knowing im that important to someone :)
You are important to me, please send your whole photo album to me so i can appreciate it.
Right? There are 8 billion humans on those planet. You are 0.0000000125% of humanity. No one outside your family and friends even knows you, nevermind gives a shit about you, unless you stick out in some way. If GP wants to take a tour of my GitHub or my blog and send me a thoughtful email, I'd be delighted!
How about when that thoughtful email becomes a visit from law enforcement because your projects don’t align with the current administration’s views? When something you said offers support for anyone other than The Party’s chosen ethnic group?
How about it? I am not that interesting or powerful at all. Yes, there's a worst case scenario where the government raids my house and I get shot, and I wouldn't like that, but I refuse to live in fear of the bogeyman.
"what if the government becomes a dictatorship" is a stupid question: you either stood up and opposed it, or you let it happen.
My privacy is important as a matter of consent.
But I should not have to hide my sexuality or identity, nor my politics and if my support of a marginalized group exists then what is the point of hiding it while they are oppressed? What benefit does that bring?
Encouraging people to be private in their views and anymore and anonymous in their "support" is exactly how fascists crush their opposition.
>But I should not have to hide my sexuality or identity, nor my politics
You shouldn't but you can't and will never be able to know what the future looks like. You could be in libertine Berlin of the 1920s and be hunted down by fascists a decade later because of your ancestry or sexuality.
And don't think that can't happen quickly again, it's not much of a hyperbole given the way the world is going. And nowadays, once you put something on the internet, good luck getting rid of it. So I'd be very careful with what I disclose, it's not paranoia any more. I'm European and flew to the US earlier this year and got asked to disclose my social media profiles. I have none, deleted them a decade ago. Is that sane or moral? No but if that's how the US rolls these days imagine where else your data can end up.
No. Why should I find you repulsive?
You might find something I wrote interesting. Then whatever public info there is on me helps you to get to know me a bit better. You may stop there and forget about me, or you may try to reach out.
There is nothing wrong about that.
>Why should I find you repulsive?
There could be a number of reasons. Am I not trying hard enough?
> Why should I find you repulsive?
Me googling your shit might lead to your real name, your family photos etc
Just because it's all public doesn't mean you want the cashier from the supermarket following you around to your family picnic
or just because you like to let the sunlight in doesn't mean you want random pedestrians peering in through your windows..
I can't believe this needs to be spelled out here: "Public" life is compartmentalized.
> Just because it's all public doesn't mean you want the cashier from the supermarket following you around to your family picnic.
This has never happened to me. Out of the space of “bad things that can happen to me” I don’t have time to worry about things with such a small probability of occurring.
But it has happened to other people. A stalker in Japan geo-located victim location from the reflection in the eye from public picture
I think if you're a fat middle aged man, it's not likely to happen to you personally. But you must have daughters, nieces, a mother, or some sort of female presence in your life. It happens to people like them.
It's more likely to happen a woman than to a man, but it's still very unlikely to happen to a woman.
Very unlikely?
~ https://www.abs.gov.au/media-centre/media-releases/1-7-austr...At about 1 in 5, it's probably happened to somebody in your family.
Don't put on the Internet what you don't want found as it's always and forever public, I thought everyone knew the first rule.
Oh boy. It's NOT about whether something's "public" or not:
It's about someone "connecting the dots" between ALL your public activities.
Someone following you OUTSIDE their "space" that you visited and then invading your other spaces.
People don't usually want to mix their social circles. e.g. nobody likes a snoopy overprotective parent following their [teen] kids around wherever the children go with their friends.
Nobody likes their spouse coming uninvited on a night out with the guys/gals.
Or, when you reply to someone on HN or Reddit, and they don't like what you say about 1 specific topic, then they go and downvote ALL your comments about everything else you said!
That's perfectly legal. It's allowed. Nothing's stopping it. And hey, you commented publicly so you were "asking for it", right?
BUT IT'S A FUCKING DICK MOVE
You can easily find my home address by starting with my HN profile.
I do understand what you are getting at. I just don’t find people repulsive by being curious of me; even if they find materials I myself did not make public.
As an aside, I sometimes stumble upon websites of people who write and show pictures of themselves and their family. I find them beautiful[0] to visit and hope more people would do that, as was more common 20 years ago.
[0] https://www.pement.org/
> I just don’t find people repulsive by being curious of me; even if they find materials I myself did not make public.
If they do it just to reach out to you with good intentions then it's fine. But if they do it to dox you or harm you in any other way, then it's not fine.
Or extracting financial gain from my data without my consent.
Someone would only be able to connect the dots based on what you publicly put out there. If you don't put anything out, there's nothing to connect the dots, unless you buy some sort of dark web leaked dataset. None of your analogies are comparable to online public information because you decide what to put out online, and I never said anything about legality so not sure why you bring that up.
You don’t necessarily decide what to put online. Friends may upload photos of you, data brokers make your information available to “people search” websites, if you buy a house your information is available unless you put it in a blind trust, etc. If you go beyond the web to private services then you have companies like Flock and retailers who use facial recognition, who make their data available to subscribers and partners.
Disturbed people with access to this data can use it to harm people, like the Ebay exec who stalked a critic or the occasional police officer who stalks a romantic interest.
> unless you buy some sort of dark web leaked dataset
Customers of such datasets: banks, insurance companies, HR companies, marketing firms, governments, etc.
I think people's idea of privacy is very simplistic and personal and relies on the disgust of a human peering over your files. Most laypeople don't have the same disgust of machines peering over their personal files that is why the weirdo video recording elicits a negative response but Meta or Alphabet doing it doesn't. Plus the fact that they "depend" on Meta and Alphabet tech makes it easier to give them a pass not unlike fans of [insert your favourite celebrity] who happily look away or justify the celebrity's bad actions.
Or people naively assume that the machine is wayyyy more impartial and privacy-isolated than it really is.
I think people would find it disgusting, it's just very hard to know what data is being used and how and sold to whom by these companies. It's a very opaque by design.
You've tripped right over the difference though.
Corporations aren't people. They do not and cannot present a personal threat to you.
Even your trailing example falls flat on this: for the activity to be distressing you had to recontextualize it back to the individual level.
It might be worth revisiting the definition of the term "Banana Republic" and the history of the United Fruit Company[1].
Corporations have toppled democratic governments, run dodgy drug trials and given breast feeding mothers just enough free powdered milk to stop being able to feed their babies.
We have large online retailers, Temu and Shein, accused of using forced labour aka slavery.
Even a well known SaaS operation like eBay was caught sending live spiders to woman who criticised them[2].
Corporations are entities with legal rights but are motivated solely by profit. Without laws to regulate them they would unemotionally run right over you.
Corporation are, and I choose my words carefully, absolute cunts.
They can 100% can present a threat to you. We wouldn't have the concept of corporate manslaughter if they didn't.
1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Fruit_Company
2. https://apnews.com/article/786117108cdfefb40e691b1b3420c689
Not to mention corporations GOVERNED ENTIRE COUNTRIES:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/East_India_Company
There were literal wars started and people murdered over corporate interests.
> Corporations ... do not and cannot present a personal threat to you.
...is this for real
Holy fucking hell. Someone please, I can't