> more likely to get planning permission if their new skyscraper included a free public roof terrace
If that's the deal, it's crazy that some of those places are getting away with then discouraging the public from actually going there. Book your visit in advance! Present ID! Photography forbidden! This grumpy security guard will be hovering nearby <3
It's like Nathan For You S03E01 where a store advertises a $1 TV, then tells the drawn in would-be customers to please respect the black tie dress code, crawl through a tiny door, and squeeze past the alligator.
The problem is worse outside London, hotels in conservation areas that get planning for health clubs on the basis that locals can buy memberships too, then quietly withdrawn. A car park that should be open for public paid parking becomes private.
It's a fantastic idea, but enforcement sucks on intangible things like this. In a few years time I'm sure it will be 'closed for maintenance' then never reopen to the public or a nice restaurant will go up there and suddenly you'll need a restaurant booking to use the lift.
This is basically a lose-lose situation: extra bureaucracy for development projects that actually benefits the local residents (planning applications can get to thousands of pages long, and the whole process takes a really long time [0]), and local residents don't actually get the benefits intended by policies like this. The only people this benefits are those who have a lot of money to throw at things like this.
[0]: https://www.thetimes.com/uk/london/article/shoreditch-works-...
You must book in advance because they’re incredibly popular, huge queues, long waits, and capacity limits. The Sky Garden (Fenchurch Building) is huge, beautiful and absolutely packed with people. Many people consider it a London must visit.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/20_Fenchurch_Street#Sky_garden
Capacity may indeed be a reason for requiring advance bookings.
But it doesn't explain the ridiculous security (scanning gates, had to take off my hat and belt, insulin pump was inspected), the prohibition of "professional" photography equipment, prohibition of own food and drinks (again, diabetes, I want to carry some lemonade and a bar for emergency), etc etc.
Is it to counter terrorism? To boost consuming at the establishments? Or is it a lame excuse thats in reality just a higher bar to entry?
> Is it to counter terrorism?
They’re worried that if there was an incident they might get sued for having inadequate security.
I’ve spent a lot of time going to places with security like this (airports, museums etc) and getting a belt with plastic buckles (you can get them at outdoor clothing stores) saves a lot of hassle.
> the prohibition of "professional" photography equipment
You want endless influencer photoshoots with professional lighting setups and whatnot?
I mean it's open to the public, or it's not… And if the owner get a say on who can enter and who cannot, then it's not.
Have you visited The View from The Shard? A very expensive visit, with exactly the same security checks as Sky Garden. Security in tall buildings is high (even if that security is mostly theatre).
"Certain items cannot be brought into The View from The Shard including large bags and backpacks, over the size of 22 x 15 x 8 inches (55 x 38 x 20 cm) or other large equipment."
"We ask guests to walk through metal detectors, which use a low-frequency electromagnetic field to look for metal items."
https://www.theviewfromtheshard.com/frequently-asked-questio...
The Shard has a hotel (Shangri La) with a separate entrance, and no security to get up to the 52nd floor Gong bar (as well as several other restaurants and bar from 30th floor and up)
Next door you need to go through a scanner to get up to the restaurants on the 31st and 32nd floor of the Shard.
Security in these buildings is very arbitrary. I can get that some of the more high profile places feel more of a need for security, and assume that anyone up to no good will perhaps not be the brightest of the bunch and/or will go for more symbolic targets, but still.
Right, the security is all theatre. My comparison is specifically to show that the security at Sky Garden (free) is not implemented to discourage free visitors when The View from The Shard charges lots of money and wants as many visitors as possible and has the same security.
I agree with that. Which tall buildings in London has security or not is really haphazard and absolutely correlates very little with fees.
This is also true for visitors to the offices located in the shard, it's very annoying to unload a overnight bag when trying to visit an office. I always wondered what the purpose was as regular employees skip the security queue
If you graph obesity and excess security, especially these "metal detectors", there is correlation, thus we should all sue.
>Is it to counter terrorism? To boost consuming at the establishments? Or is it a lame excuse thats in reality just a higher bar to entry?
Incentives align among all three.
Last time I was in London for a day, I simply reserved a table at one of the restaurants at Sky Garden and got in without any queues. Maybe I booked it on the previous evening, but not much earlier than that.
Ok that one looks legit :)
I was thinking more about his experience with e.g. the last one on the page, Roof Garden at The Post Building:
> I still don't understand why it's here nor why it's open daily, nor why they insist on Photo ID "and a full written name" before they'll let you up. However I didn't get the chance to test this out yesterday because when I arrived the roof terrace was "closed due to essential maintenance work", inconveniencing probably nobody but myself.
Sky Garden is really the only one that does not make it hard. No need to book - just pop up there for with your sandwiches for lunch, and I think it's the best roof garden in city.
You might need to queue for a little while on a weekend or at prime lunchtime.
The others you need to book weeks ahead, so agree with the previous post that they do make it hard. Sky Garden is not one of them.
The odd thing is you certainly used to have book
Lived in london for over a decade, never been and I also don't think I know anyone else who's been.
To be fair it's not just that, you won't find many actual londoners in central full stop unless they're going to work
I wouldn’t say that’s an accurate generalisation.
I’ll often meet and hang out with friends in central London.
> Lived in london for over a decade
> actual londoners
So which is it? Lots of expats in London. They aren’t tourist but they aren’t born-and-bred londoners, are they?
I'm not a proper Londoner but I am English, I stand by my comment though - people who actually grew up in London would be even less likely to be found in central London on a Saturday
I was born in the city I live in and so were my kids. They’ve never visited the #1 tourist attraction, and I only did when I was a kid.
My experience living in the UK was that we’d go off as a family to visit Arundel Castle or one of the hundred other amazing things nearby, and the Brits I worked with would say “oh yeah, I went there on a school trip…” or “oh I’ve heard it’s nice.”
Denizens of a place don’t always appreciate what their location offers. That doesn’t make them cool or better than tourists.
That said, I agree that central London is not somewhere I desperately want to go every day. But there’s a lot of great stuff there.
Yeah true, that's fair enough. And you're right there is good stuff in central especially if you're into cultural stuff (theatre, art galleries etc.) - that stuff is all in central and I absolutely take it for granted, there's only a few cities that can match London for that.
I think I'm just jaded from trying to wade through waddling masses of tourists whenever I make the mistake of going anywhere remotely central on a Saturday or Sunday, but I get why if you're a tourist that stuff probably seems cool
I mean they also seem to charge it? (According to the blogpost) then how is it free to the public?
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=hfW2q4PW_C8
This is the country where organised marches must have police approval and follow an approved route (and most acute in London). Hardly a surprise!
London's vibe is: 'privately owned, and you're lucky to be here'
Edit: I'm British btw (and currently sat in a pub in London) in case people downvote me thinking I'm a yank lol. There are many people who dislike London and the UK who aren't yanks
In most countries in Europe organized marches and protests must be run by authorities. It's pretty normal here.
Protesting is a legal right but the authorities do have the right to restrict it for public order reasons. For example they often will insist on separate routes to keep conflicting groups apart. It makes sense too.
> This is the country where organised marches must have police approval and follow an approved route
You have to notify the police not get approval. They can "impose conditions and restrictions" for safety or to limit the rights of others to travel freely, after which they'll also be somewhat liable to protect you from counter-protesters, or lunatics trying to drive their car at you.
Just about every country requires some kind of advance notice if its not just a few people walking along the pavement/sidewalk and your going to obstruct traffic or block others movement
https://groups.friendsoftheearth.uk/resources/your-rights-an...
NB. It's article 11 of the European Convention on Human Rights[1] which gives us "the right to freedom of peaceful assembly and to freedom of association with others, including the right to form and to join trade unions for the protection of his interests."
Reform's manifesto includes[2]: "Stop the Boats with our 4 Point Plan. Leave the European Convention on Human Rights."
[1] https://fra.europa.eu/en/law-reference/european-convention-h...
[2] Page 5 of https://reformuk.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2025/10/Reform_UK...
I know that you think you just mitigated the extreme character of what he said? But you exacerbated it.
Exactly my thoughts lol
Disagree on that vibe. The museums are usually free in London, for example. Haven't seen that in many other cities.
Its not as if things are any better in the country that boasts the most about its freedoms regarding access to supposedly public spaces: https://www.instagram.com/780_lord_of_bench
Even within London people dislike each other!
Saw many non-Arsenal fans cheering for PSG yesterday.
There are thousands of protests per year in central London. The larger ones (tens of thousands of people) are going to be disrupting public transport routes than people rely on. There's an approved route so that disruption can be managed. Nothing to do with being 'privately owned'. It also doesn't help that for a large number of people 'protesting' means travelling into London, getting drunk, and fighting.
How many protestors did the U.K. police kill in the last few years, compared to, say, a very free country… like the U.S?
edit: responding to your edit, of course many British people hate London and for many valid reasons, but your reasoning is very American. Very few British people share that American view of freedom and would describe London as “privately owned”.
How many protestors did they arrest?
and the city of London is literally a private corporation.
No, it isn't. It is called 'City of London Corporation' in the sense of being a municipal corporation, but effectively it's just a local authority... except that businesses still get a vote along with citizens.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Municipal_corporation
The City of London is a novel anachronism making up a square mile that nobody British would ever refer to as “London” nor do they complain about it being “private”.
> but your reasoning is very American.
For god's sake how ridiculous. Give over
What's your basis for commenting on us Brits? You can't even spell UK correctly (we don't use full stops. That's an Americanism / hypercorrection). You spell with a z, so not a Brit
I am no less British than you. I was born in England, raised in England, educated in England, voted in England, my parents were born in England, my grandparents were born in England, my great grandparents were born in England… so on and so forth. I am very sorry that my choice to use American spelling on an American website offends you.
The irony is that the beliefs you’re espousing are an infection caused by U.S. cultural dominance of politics on the Internet. Anti-woke right wing people are heavily influenced by American political attitudes. Do you also believe in Birmingham’s no-go zones?
British people are miserable and cynical and hate everything about our godforsaken country but London being “privately owned” is not one of those things. Civilized protest is not one of those things.
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The IRA is more “British” than some of these commentators.
Arguing over who is more “British” isn’t the flex you and the GP think it is. All it demonstrates is close mindedness towards others.
My beautiful bloo passport would disagree.
what the fuck is your problem? i was trying to be a bit whimsical in my reply. "sorry" for trying to be a bit light hearted
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I lived and worked in that area for many years. I have walked through Whitechapel day and night. Yes, there are a lot of Muslims in the area due to the nearby mosque. The only violence or trouble I ever experienced in the area was with other white people. Whitechapel is a busy part of central London, if you're going to choose a part of London to claim that there is a no go zone, at least try somewhere that isn't on the tourist track, like Poplar (although that isn't a no go zone either, but it's at least a little more plausible).
"Auditing" videos are antagonists causing trouble and videoing it, often either deceptively editing or outright fabricating interactions. People, of course, have strong views, regardless of race or religion, and antagonising them is going to bring out the most extreme of those views. Going to an area with many muslims and trying to antagonise muslims does not make a no-go zone. You can go to whitechapel any time day or night and the only risk is a pissed up local, which, ironically, won't be a Muslim because they don't drink. Alcohol is the main cause of danger in London.
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Practicing Muslims, ie the ones that would be worshiping in a mosque in Whitechapel, are unlikely to be the same pissed up uni students that you’re thinking of.
Just like not all Jewish people are orthodox and not all Christian’s are catholic.
The GP was correct when they rebutted the ridiculous “no-go” claim.
You're conflating practicing and non-practicing Muslims. The scary violent gang of Muslims enforcing the "no go zone" of Whitechapel by violencing every white person who dares stray from gentrified Shoreditch to the wild east of Whitechapel are practicing Muslims, and every single one of them is sober. If you're not too scared, you could go and ask.
And yes, someone who lived in London for most of their adult life will have spent a lot of time in major parts of the city, that is not very surprising. I ate at the Whitechapel McDonalds hundreds of times.
In case you're interested, the most dangerous part of London I've lived was Mile End because of that weird, creepy, hideous hotel, next to the bus stop, that turned out to be the one used by the Russian poisoners that came to London on their way to wherever it was they killed those people. I was metres away from Novichok! Far scarier than any Muslim.