I think you can turn this into a proper, nuanced position by contrasting how the US typically values protection of free speech higher than protection from libel/slander/defamation.
Just consider prominent recent examples, like the german student protester that was investigated by police and had his sign confiscated (it just said "Merz (current cancellor) suck balls"). This seems ridiculous and draconian by US standards.
I haven't seen it here much (apart from proper rednecky comments equating carrying gun everywhere with some actual personal freedoms but those are rare).
But most US population ain't HN, at all. Most don't travel, get their opinion on the world from CNN or Fox news with corresponding results and thus have rather primitive view on rest of the world (sorry, that is true, one needs to travel a bit to understand world).
You don't travel when you are crushed by debt and rising costs from all sides, do you.
This is not only an American problem. Most people in most countries get their view of the rest of the world from mass media and social media. In some places people think particular groups they meet or read about (e.g. tourists or workers) are typical of the country they come from.
Travel produces different distortions. A lot of British people think the rest of the world is a lot better than it is because they visit places on holiday: they visit nice places and have good experiences. I have known some to get into messes when they actually try to live somewhere else.
just a note: the RSF World Press Freedom Index is not based on hard data or sound statistics, it's based on a few questionnaires sent to journalists picked by RSF itself.
How many it's unclear, but it was ~150[0] some years ago, of which 50 in France[1] to monitor 180 countries.
It's worth as a generic "are we doing better than last year?" but I wouldn't consider ranking to be particularly meaningful.
As an European, you think you actually have free speech? Go say something negative about Muslims or your country being full during any protest, I dare you. Because you will absolutely face criminal charges for that.
People who frame UK as oppressive hellhole, but somehow like former Hungarian leader and know all the talking points of the American conservative right.
Moreover, the repeating talking points of these people seemed to exclusively be around some cases where police intervened for certain comments on transgender issues (and imo indeed police shouldn't). It was a big issue back then, but when police intervenes now (mostly UK/germany) for certain comments on the palestinean issues, or when bank accounts are blocked for this reason (under cross-border requests from the US no less), they no longer seem to care. Makes you think whether they did not really care as much about free speech itself, actually.
> exclusively be around some cases where police intervened for certain comments on transgender issues
Those tended to be gratuitously misreported as well, where the reports would say "this person was arrested for making [relatively innocuous comment] on social media]" and then you discover that the actual issue was a lengthy period of harassment and doxing directed at a specific trans person. Or encouraging other people to burn down a hotel, or so on.
Vance is far shrewder than many of the surrounding idiots. My guess is that he went because someone like Trump thought it a good idea, and kissing arse is Vance’s current strategy.
Well its the only winning strategy currently, thats for sure.
But good for us, more visits of these folks who have very negative image in rest of the world. Any corrupt entrenched a-hole would be nice, what about Fico in Slovakia? Orban's best buddy in mindset and methodologies. Next one is Babis in Czech republic. With that done, EU would be free from corrupt russian double agents, for now at least.
There are so many shades of gray in freedom of speech. In free European countries the police are also not at the door of outspoken government critics.
If you are alluding to dictatorial European countries like Russia and Belarus, the US is miles away and moving in their direction. Compared to Western Europe, there is no difference.
You will be subject to mandatory facial recognition technology with long-term storage, though. The US may certainly be the worst but Europe is also going in an authoritarian direction.
In "why not both" news, both sides are pursuing increasingly aggressive immigration enforcement, which is imposed on everyone who goes through an airport.
(Intra-Schengen flights lets you avoid most of this, but the heavier enforcement on extra-Schengen is the tradeoff)
People who say there is no free speech in Europe have never lived in an authoritarian country.
But its mainly Americans saying it here on HN.
I think you can turn this into a proper, nuanced position by contrasting how the US typically values protection of free speech higher than protection from libel/slander/defamation.
Just consider prominent recent examples, like the german student protester that was investigated by police and had his sign confiscated (it just said "Merz (current cancellor) suck balls"). This seems ridiculous and draconian by US standards.
I haven't seen it here much (apart from proper rednecky comments equating carrying gun everywhere with some actual personal freedoms but those are rare).
But most US population ain't HN, at all. Most don't travel, get their opinion on the world from CNN or Fox news with corresponding results and thus have rather primitive view on rest of the world (sorry, that is true, one needs to travel a bit to understand world).
You don't travel when you are crushed by debt and rising costs from all sides, do you.
This is not only an American problem. Most people in most countries get their view of the rest of the world from mass media and social media. In some places people think particular groups they meet or read about (e.g. tourists or workers) are typical of the country they come from.
Travel produces different distortions. A lot of British people think the rest of the world is a lot better than it is because they visit places on holiday: they visit nice places and have good experiences. I have known some to get into messes when they actually try to live somewhere else.
See if you can find the US in these rankings:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Press_Freedom_Index
More evidence, if it's needed.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Economist_Democracy_Index
The USA's score has taken rather a tumble since 2016 (I wonder why?).
just a note: the RSF World Press Freedom Index is not based on hard data or sound statistics, it's based on a few questionnaires sent to journalists picked by RSF itself.
How many it's unclear, but it was ~150[0] some years ago, of which 50 in France[1] to monitor 180 countries.
It's worth as a generic "are we doing better than last year?" but I wouldn't consider ranking to be particularly meaningful.
[0] https://web.archive.org/web/20130819031406/http://en.rsf.org...
[1] https://akademie.dw.com/en/the-press-freedom-index-by-report...
LIES from the Radical Left Lunatics from reporters without borders! Also, total Losers! USA is #1 in not Supressing the Speech that Really Matters!
As an European, you think you actually have free speech? Go say something negative about Muslims or your country being full during any protest, I dare you. Because you will absolutely face criminal charges for that.
Who's still claiming the US has free speech?
Freedom House. But then again, most of their funding comes from the US state department.
People who frame UK as oppressive hellhole, but somehow like former Hungarian leader and know all the talking points of the American conservative right.
Moreover, the repeating talking points of these people seemed to exclusively be around some cases where police intervened for certain comments on transgender issues (and imo indeed police shouldn't). It was a big issue back then, but when police intervenes now (mostly UK/germany) for certain comments on the palestinean issues, or when bank accounts are blocked for this reason (under cross-border requests from the US no less), they no longer seem to care. Makes you think whether they did not really care as much about free speech itself, actually.
> exclusively be around some cases where police intervened for certain comments on transgender issues
Those tended to be gratuitously misreported as well, where the reports would say "this person was arrested for making [relatively innocuous comment] on social media]" and then you discover that the actual issue was a lengthy period of harassment and doxing directed at a specific trans person. Or encouraging other people to burn down a hotel, or so on.
most ppl only care about their own speech being free
The US constitution?
JD Vance has to save all of Europe because of checks notes lack of free speech. /s
Well, he did a good job of freeing Hungary from Orban. So, cut him some slack.
/s
Paradoxically they are so stupid they thought they are actually helping Orban not realizing Europeans consider them idiots.
Vance is far shrewder than many of the surrounding idiots. My guess is that he went because someone like Trump thought it a good idea, and kissing arse is Vance’s current strategy.
Well its the only winning strategy currently, thats for sure.
But good for us, more visits of these folks who have very negative image in rest of the world. Any corrupt entrenched a-hole would be nice, what about Fico in Slovakia? Orban's best buddy in mindset and methodologies. Next one is Babis in Czech republic. With that done, EU would be free from corrupt russian double agents, for now at least.
After seeing how meeting the pope went, I’m surprised Orban was keen for a visit. He was lucky it was just his political death.
Why? The police aren't at his door and he's not been arrested it's not a good thing but we are still miles away from Europe.
She is a woman.
There are so many shades of gray in freedom of speech. In free European countries the police are also not at the door of outspoken government critics.
If you are alluding to dictatorial European countries like Russia and Belarus, the US is miles away and moving in their direction. Compared to Western Europe, there is no difference.
Europe where? Europe is a whole continent with 40+ different countries...
The FBI shows up if you write about the pres.
But tbh its so much nicer when journalists self censor to not lose their job because of access to healthcare.
Or when billionaires buy entire media empires and fire journalists critical of the goverment.
Bezos owning WP, Murdoch owning everything else, Sinclair owning local stations... the free speech is so fucking goood
Writing an op-ed can get the police on you here. The first amendment isn't supposed to only apply to citizens.
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/ng-interactive/2026/feb/...
A photo of seashells gets you indicted:
https://edition.cnn.com/2026/04/28/politics/justice-departme...
Where is there a problem in Europe?
I if want to go to the US on the other hand, I need to give them my social media accounts. That doesn't sound like free speech to me
Chat Control is also at the door, and almost being invited in.
You will be subject to mandatory facial recognition technology with long-term storage, though. The US may certainly be the worst but Europe is also going in an authoritarian direction.
In "why not both" news, both sides are pursuing increasingly aggressive immigration enforcement, which is imposed on everyone who goes through an airport.
(Intra-Schengen flights lets you avoid most of this, but the heavier enforcement on extra-Schengen is the tradeoff)