It's so bizarre to me when North Americans proudly claim "Viking ancestry", rather than Scandinavian. Like, beyond it not being an ethnicity, you're identifying specifically with violent raiders who killed peaceful monks, even if that's romanticized by media. It's like proudly claiming "pirate" or perhaps more poignantly in current times "ICE agent ancestry".
> rather than Scandinavian
Strange, being in North America, I've yet to meet anyone identify themself as having viking blood, but we refer to Scandinavians as being of viking ancestry all the time.
I grew up in Minnesota and have literally never heard anyone ever say this about me or any other person of Scandinavian origin.
You've never heard of your NFL football team?
Sport team names have nothing to do with declaring ancestry.
Tampa Bay Buccaneers? Las Vegas Raiders?
Do you think the LA Rams have that name to claim ancestry?
You're absolutely correct.
"They are named after the Vikings of medieval Scandinavia, reflecting the prominent Scandinavian American culture of Minnesota."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minnesota_Vikings
This is not the zinger you think it is, my dude.
I've heard it, but only in a tongue-in-cheek context, at least the way I've always interpreted it.
Ugh, consider yourself lucky then. Can easily meet a new one each week if your social circle isn't too selective. Usually someones cousin that tags along. At least they can't survive long without the rest of the tribe, so they don't become regulars.
pretty common on twitter, esp these days where there is strong anglo-saxon white nationalism crowd
they do romanticize their ancient past as one of conquest and domination over others.
btw, even without the viking aspect, norse law was pretty strange in that it allowed murder for a fine. there is definitely a savage aspect to white tradition as there is to any modern culture, but there is a lot of whitewashing thats done to present anglo saxons as racially superior, highly civilized culture.
> pretty common on twitter
All sorts of strange things are common on twitter that are completely absent in real life. It shouldn't be used for any measure of reality, especially if you're judging the people of a continent.
White ethno-nationalism is not exactly irrelevant to current U.S. news & politics.
and that is thanks to amplifying fringe and/or fake junk from twitter!
Restorative justice isn't that unusual in the world. Blood money has roots all over the place. Paying victims or their family/clan/tribe for deaths or injury is not unusual especially if the perpetrator is of higher status than the victim.
...so a common meme for bots
It's common among usian nazis of the David Lane strain, and on Facebook you can find quite a lot of "viking" groups mainly populated by usian dinguses, some of whom claim some scandinavian ancestor or other.
> It's so bizarre to me when North Americans proudly claim "Viking ancestry", rather than Scandinavian.
Where did you hear it? I am sure at least one out of hundreds of millions of Americans claimed it. But you know, we have people who think the earth is flat, as well. But by that token one can take any dumb thing someone from a large group said and sort of say “why do all X say this one dumb thing”
At least from my experience I only heard people claim Scandinavian ancestry. Or even more specifically a country like Norway or Sweden for example. Places like Minnesota or Wisconsin have a lot of that.
> you're identifying specifically with violent raiders who killed peaceful monks
That's not that surprising; figures like Caesar and Genghis Khan are still being worshiped today. Hell, most famous European monarchs are famous because of their violence. It's a lot easier to forgive murder when it happened centuries ago.
There are five million Irish in Ireland and something like 75 million “Irish” in the US. And Chicago has more Polish that Warsaw, but that’s actual expats and their kids. Not great great great grandchildren of Margaret and John who came over in 1845.
This source puts that number at 35M of people with "some" Irish descent: https://overlandirelandtours.com/blog/why-are-there-more-iri... — that means that most of them probably have some other heritage too.
People say similar stuff about Serbians in Chicago (how it's the second biggest Serbian city after Belgrade), but usually all of that is overestimated significantly. Just like people overestimate their local city population (most in Belgrade claim it has 2M people when census on a metropolitan area gets us to 1.57M).
People say a very similar thing about the number of Greeks in Melbourne, Australia.
> There are five million Irish in Ireland and something like 75 million “Irish” in the US.
Reminds me of this sketch. [0]
> And Chicago has more Polish that Warsaw, but that’s actual expats and their kids.
This is one of those persistent myths. While Chicago has many Poles and people of Polish ancestry living there, it has never exceeded the population of Warsaw. And New York has more Poles than Chicago.
[0] https://youtu.be/xzlMME_sekI
The reason I like to use the Polish example is that I got it straight from a Polish dissident, and a second one didn't correct me when I repeated it to him later.
Nobody has official numbers on populations that are a mix of documented and undocumented people. But I trust members of those groups and their relatives probably have a better estimate, even if it's offset by not having a degree in statistics.
It makes sense if you're Irish or British. People here who are blond and blue-eyed but whose ancestors come from Ireland assume they have Viking ancestry, and they're probably right since the Viking era was the main time Scandinavians mixed into the Irish gene pool. It doesn't have white nationalist connotations: the alt-right probably identify more with Celtic iconography if anything.
If you're American, it doesn't make as much sense, because Scandinavians and Germans have been coming to America for hundreds of years.
Never heard someone saying they were Vikings tbh.
I don't think I've ever heard anyone IRL say they have viking ancestors.
Yearning for Valhalla is more a specific type of extremely online poster / podcast bro / FBI director kind of behavior.
Would wearing a haircut from that dreadful viking TV show and a Thor hammer necklace count? I’ve seen quite a meme-worthy characters over the years
Modern paganism went through a revival during the early 2000s. Are you sure you're not just seeing someone's religion?
And its not the first time, either. There's been several revivals of the beliefs and culture over the years - for example, we didn't even have the word 'viking' in English until the 18th Century.
No, that's not specifying the Viking job, just old nordic culture. I don't think that anyone wearing a cross is pretending to be a crusader.
The modern Techno Viking:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UjCdB5p2v0Y
There was that one Indian guy who hit the gym, bleached his skin and hair and now does a pretty credible Viking impression.
Crazy what people will do for a government pension
Much like pirates and gangsters, Vikings are cool if you consider them from an aesthetic as opposed to moralistic perspective. Everyone has evil ancestors, but some of them were cool.
Ninjas, samurai, Native Americans in war paint, etc. It's like every culture (that has survived) has reverence for their own group.
It's one thing to find a culture fascinating, but this "aesthetic" is generally a construct of the imagination cobbled out of stereotypes.
Yes, but when you call it "pillaging" it sounds much more romantic.
It’s called the power of branding.
Someone online from a region of North England was proud that he was more of a viking than Scandinavians because the Scandinavians that came to that place were definitely going viking. Not just lazy Scandinavians that stayed home all the time on their ill-geography farms.
If his ancestors remained in England following the viking age, then he's 0% viking. I take it he's conflating vikings with the great heathen army.
Those monks were part of a system intending to push out the native beliefs of the inhabitants of the land as a soft form of conquering.
1. People yearn for identity labels. It's a core part of human existance.
2. "White" and "American" are problematic identity labels. People therefore often reach back toward European ancestry (real or supposed), for identity labels that are less controversial.
3. The average person isn't aware (or concerned) that "Viking" isn't strictly an ethnicity. Because it's nevertheless a commonly used identity label.
Not everything has to be an opportunity to spot Nazis hiding behind every tree, or showcase your pedant chops. People wear shamrock jewelry or put an Italian flag bumper sticker on their car because it's fun and feels good, simple as that. Only a small number of legit white supremacists, and a legion of absolutely insufferable Internet progressives, think about this all that deeply.
You are getting struck hard by the comments, so I'll provide some source about the concept of Viking in American self identity.
>In the United States, mainstream Americans incorporated Vikings into emerging Anglo-Saxon racial identities
https://escholarship.org/uc/item/3kq8c3g3
>As the man skims through these figures, his eyes are suddenly opened wide. According to the test results, he is “0.012% Viking.” With tears in his eyes, he falls on his knees and yells with excitement.
https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/14636778.2020.1...
Just the first papers I grabbed, there is a good chuck of research literature on viking identity of Americans. There is also several monographies on the subject like Krueger, D. M. (2015). Myths of the Rune Stone: Viking Martyrs and the Birthplace of America. Besides that there are organizations like the American Viking:
>We are loyal to our country, United States of America, bound by our Viking Heritage, and fueled by modern Longships, the Rune-Carvers, and the Skalds.
https://www.americanviking.org/about
I think its a bit harsh dismissing the idea of Viking ancestry as a thing in USA. It might be linked to white supremacy, and mainly experienced in certain circles online, but its still a real phenomenon that has been going on for a long time.
Douche bag culture is highly-competitive across the world. Is this one really NA specific? I'd bet it's common among ICE employees, but they don't represent NA as a whole.
next will be combined "genitscope" readings "astrogenetics", the "pro" reading will include your chart including planet 10
Pfft, ICE agents wish they were pirates.
In other parts of the world, plenty of people romanticize ancestry with Ghenghis Khan too.
Everyone loves being seen to be on the ‘winning’ side sometimes, (and there is always a counter-culture minority!) and when sufficiently remote in time, no one is going to really ‘feel’ the atrocities. Then it’s all about marketing and current social whims.
If the Nazi’s won, the current 80/20 pro/anti ratio would be flipped no question.
You don’t have to go very far back in history to see that humans have some pretty dark tendencies.
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You won't be downvoted because of double-standards. You'll be downvoted because this is a hard tangent from the current discussion. I suspect you know that and decide to pre-emptively deflect the reason so as to appear the victim.
Have you read the old testament? It's much the same. Why focus on this specific religion?
It's just one example, I don't think we expect commenters to hit ALL applicable examples. Why did you focus specifically on that religious text?
Please don't derail this discussion with unrelated political ragebait.
Why the political correctness though?
What does this even mean?
You do realize Tabari is not the Quran?
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